Parallax Mapping

Blender's renderer and external renderer export

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Money_YaY!
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Parallax Mapping

Postby Money_YaY! » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:34 pm

??? Sounds very new and small to add in from what I read everywhere
http://blogs.msdn.com/sebby1234/archive ... 11422.aspx
http://www.infiscape.com/doc/parallax_mapping.pdf

But I am sure that first and for most everyone needs a a Blender that can render to the CG card first before this ever comes about. Mybe it can be done with out the CG card. Would be neat .. Yet again more advisement in lowpoly rendering stuff that looks like super high poly

theeth
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Postby theeth » Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:24 pm

Unless I read the paper wrong, this still doesn't solve the problem where the edges of the model really show the lack of details.

It's nice though and you really don't need hw accelerated rendering to do that.

Martin
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans.
- John Lennon

eeshlo
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Postby eeshlo » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:16 pm

Has been mentioned on some of the mailing lists as well. Anyway, I have done experiments with that a year or so ago, and didn't really find it all that great, it depends a lot on the bump/normal map for it to look reasonably good, the smoother, the better. It is only a very rough approximation after all. High frequency bumps can actually make it look rather distorted if you're not careful.
So I didn't submit, as I though it probably wasn't considered useful, but I have made that mistake several times now...
In any case, I thought that the 'warp' option Ton added was supposed to do something like that, but it isn't really the same as parallax mapping. In my last mail to Desoto I explained how to do it, but I don't know if he forwarded it to Ton.

matt_e
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Postby matt_e » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:20 pm

I could be mistaken, but I think something like this was added by Ton when he was messing with bump maps - this 'Warp' option down the bottom: http://www.blender3d.org/cms/Normals_an ... 494.0.html

I'll be damned if I can figure out how to properly use it though.. :?

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:35 am

eeshlo never think those things.One persons trash is another users treasure. Please look at the warp feature and see if what you had could make tons warp better.

But from what I read the warpos close to the parallax Mapping. I guess I can test it out some when I get a chance.

Theeth, yes true the edges is the last straw in the puzzle. I heard about some sort of vertex normal map a while back. Do you know of any techs that might do it ? I have found nothing yet except for micro poly displacement mapping.

z3r0_d
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Postby z3r0_d » Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:21 am

Money_YaY! wrote:Theeth, yes true the edges is the last straw in the puzzle. I heard about some sort of vertex normal map a while back. Do you know of any techs that might do it ? I have found nothing yet except for micro poly displacement mapping.

someone did something really crazy with opengl and CG [on nvidia hardware only]

I'm looking for the thread

...

bah, the server is timing out:
[/me summons the power of the google cache]

check out:
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards ... 3;t=012454

now... in a software renderer, is this better than more polygons, and how would you make it work with more than a single planar surface...? ... well, it is certainly something to think about

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:13 pm

z3r0_d wrote:
Money_YaY! wrote:Theeth, yes true the edges is the last straw in the puzzle. I heard about some sort of vertex normal map a while back. Do you know of any techs that might do it ? I have found nothing yet except for micro poly displacement mapping.

someone did something really crazy with opengl and CG [on nvidia hardware only]

I'm looking for the thread

...

bah, the server is timing out:
[/me summons the power of the google cache]

check out:
http://www.opengl.org/discussion_boards ... 3;t=012454

now... in a software renderer, is this better than more polygons, and how would you make it work with more than a single planar surface...? ... well, it is certainly something to think about


aw pictures!
http://www.paralelo.com.br/img/relief_m ... monkey.jpg
http://www.paralelo.com.br/img/rockwall_sphere.jpg
http://www.paralelo.com.br/img/rockwall_teapot.jpg
http://www.paralelo.com.br/img/relief_sphere.jpg

But no edge bumping :(

theeth
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Postby theeth » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:19 pm

Actually, one way to solve the edge problem would be to offset the polygons along their normals for the ray collision dection, then test if it hits the real surface (the one being displaced). If it doesn't, keep shooting the ray in its original direction.

Martin
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans.

- John Lennon

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:26 pm

theeth wrote:Actually, one way to solve the edge problem would be to offset the polygons along their normals for the ray collision dection, then test if it hits the real surface (the one being displaced). If it doesn't, keep shooting the ray in its original direction.

Martin


But would this work on really low poly mesh like say a 6 face cube that has 8 vertices? Faking a 2 vertice edge to look like it has hundreds of vertices would the grail.

theeth
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Postby theeth » Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:53 pm

It should work regardless of geometry. What I'm suggesting would only work on a renderer which uses rays for its first pass (ie: YafRay, not Blender's internal). I'm not knowledgeable enough about scanline renders to know if this method could be adapted.

Martin
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans.

- John Lennon

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Wed Dec 15, 2004 9:40 pm

theeth wrote:It should work regardless of geometry. What I'm suggesting would only work on a renderer which uses rays for its first pass (ie: YafRay, not Blender's internal). I'm not knowledgeable enough about scanline renders to know if this method could be adapted.

Martin


Aw, neat noneless. eeshlo could this work ? Your still incharge of Yafray no ?

eeshlo
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Postby eeshlo » Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:22 pm

Money_YaY! wrote:It should work regardless of geometry. Aw, neat noneless. eeshlo could this work ? Your still incharge of Yafray no ?


Me in charge of yafray? Yafray is the work of Alejandro Conty Estevez, not me. Well, I contributed some things here and there, but I'm not in charge of it. I simply have the time to post on forums, Jandro has not, or at least is not interested in that, he is probably busy enough as it is.

In any case, this would work in Blender as well using hybrid scanline/raytrace. In fact some work I'm doing (or at least, supposed to do) is actually based on this principle.

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:36 pm

eeshlo wrote:
Money_YaY! wrote:It should work regardless of geometry. Aw, neat noneless. eeshlo could this work ? Your still incharge of Yafray no ?


Me in charge of yafray? Yafray is the work of Alejandro Conty Estevez, not me. Well, I contributed some things here and there, but I'm not in charge of it. I simply have the time to post on forums, Jandro has not, or at least is not interested in that, he is probably busy enough as it is.

In any case, this would work in Blender as well using hybrid scanline/raytrace. In fact some work I'm doing (or at least, supposed to do) is actually based on this principle.


Cool. If you do add it in, it would be a 'new' kind of feature that other programs do not have yet. And could help get some press and more developers if that is wanted :P

eeshlo
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Postby eeshlo » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:13 pm

I wasn't talking about this particular subject, just something that is based on similar principles, nothing more. It is not really a new idea either.

theeth
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Postby theeth » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:41 pm

And I don't quite believe what I suggested is original either. Anybody with some basic knowledge (and I mean very basic) of raytracing could think of that.

Martin
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans.

- John Lennon


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