Armature proposal

Animation tools, character animation, non linear animation

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Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Tue Feb 10, 2004 12:25 am

theeth wrote:Just parenting boxes to the bones would have the same effect.

Martin

No that will not work. As the armature is still seen. I have done this, but that just makes *more* lines. I would like it where the mesh it'self could be the armature as in selecting the arm block will move the arm just like an armature.

Why ? Because change is good , and it is better to see it as a mesh as that is what you are animating anyway. Now I know that posting it here is not going to get it created at all I just want to make you see what I am seeing theeth.

theeth
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Postby theeth » Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:16 am

Change for change is stupid. Change for a good reason is good, but I personnally don't see advantages that would be worth the effort here.

Martin
Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans.
- John Lennon

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:48 am

umm, it seems that a page was removed . Theeth your reply about change is good if it is for something good.

I view less lines as very good.

Here are two more pics. They have messy and less messy. One side with the armature and emptys that I use ( yes I still use the emptys, I like the pull string method better) and one as a demo of what it would look like with out the armature and emptys.

Image

Image


They are still a far cry from what I would love to see as a clean screen. But this is what I work in. Like I said , I doubt that anybody will pick up the idea, but I might as well post it.

:D

Monkeyboi
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Postby Monkeyboi » Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:35 pm

Money_YaY, I don't think you idea is completely rubbish. I think it would be interesting to offer different armature drawtypes to the user (including one that could be seen in Solid mode as a series of boxes a la character studio for MAX).

One big problem that certinately contributes to the confusing looks of armatures is the fact that nulls (handles) look like regular bones (or you can use empties in Object mode, but then you cannot use Actions or the NLA Editor, and it means you have to jump between Object and Pose mode all the time. Anyway, Empties still aren't as clear as the proposed armature nulls.) If you could have better looking nulls that would to a great extent solve the issue of confusing looking armatures.


-William

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Tue Feb 10, 2004 3:02 pm

Ok. I will build a log for all of this. How I see it. What if instead of the current thing it could draw a plane and extrude the plane. And during this use the hide commaand to hide the armature. That way the armature is still there just invisable. On top of this it could draw an axis joint to. But in mesh like a simple tri face axis ball in three colors.

hmmm ideas flowing in head aaaawww!!!

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Tue Feb 10, 2004 3:35 pm

3d Mesh axis joint , it could appear when a bone is selected

Image

Image

Monkeyboi
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Postby Monkeyboi » Thu Feb 12, 2004 6:58 pm

The 3d axis joint looks quite nice, although it may be a bit resource heavy, dunno.

Also, it looks a bit inconsistant with Blender design. You have chosen yellow, red and purple, although Blenders axes colours are as follows:

red=X
green=Y
blue=Z

Better reuse the same colours. Maybe it could loose the 3D look, or be rendered in more solid colours without shading. Btw, is it a handle (which you can grab), or just something to indicate which way a bone is facing?

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Fri Feb 13, 2004 1:10 am

Monkeyboi wrote:The 3d axis joint looks quite nice, although it may be a bit resource heavy, dunno.

Also, it looks a bit inconsistant with Blender design. You have chosen yellow, red and purple, although Blenders axes colours are as follows:

red=X
green=Y
blue=Z

Better reuse the same colours. Maybe it could loose the 3D look, or be rendered in more solid colours without shading. Btw, is it a handle (which you can grab), or just something to indicate which way a bone is facing?



ALL true. The colors I picked were just random. I would rather like it to be flat colors I will rebuilt it in tuhopuu that will look better. And it could be used as both an axis turn style and a pully joint. It would only appear with the selected bone or axis. That waya there are not a million axiswidgets on your model like bugs :O

Monkeyboi
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Postby Monkeyboi » Sat Feb 14, 2004 1:47 am

I think it sounds interesting that you would want it to be a handle, but maybe that part should be done at the same time as the other modifyers are made for moving, rotating and scaling (on the Blender todo list).

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Sun Feb 15, 2004 5:39 pm

New plan of attack.
My tuhopuu build is on the fritz so I can not update the images.

But the plan for a hacked implemention could be like so.

[list=]
Create a normal armatutre chain.
Parent it to the box model
Press a new button to 'hide all bones' but still make them selectable.
Now here is the tricky part. Somehow make the mesh light up when selected as the armature piece.
pull.

[/list]

Monkeyboi
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Postby Monkeyboi » Sun Feb 15, 2004 10:53 pm

You are talking about animating by grabbing actual parts of the mesh?

Like so(from Sega Animanium):
Image

Sure that would be nice I suppose, and possible too. when you select the upper leg on the mesh, it could 'under the hood' select the upper leg armature. You would basicly be selecting vertex groups in Pose Mode.

Dunno quite how this could work in the UI though.

Money_YaY!
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Postby Money_YaY! » Mon Feb 16, 2004 2:07 am

Monkeyboi wrote:You are talking about animating by grabbing actual parts of the mesh?

Like so(from Sega Animanium):


Sure that would be nice I suppose, and possible too. when you select the upper leg on the mesh, it could 'under the hood' select the upper leg armature. You would basicly be selecting vertex groups in Pose Mode.

Dunno quite how this could work in the UI though.


Perfect! That is what I was thinking ! Of course it would not be as powerfull, but the power to select the mesh instead sound good. I will make this the first of my Bounty list.

pildanovak
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Postby pildanovak » Mon Feb 16, 2004 1:50 pm

When talking about the bones, i've also thought about visualising the range in which the bone has effect when used for auto-skinning - some kind of elipsoid around the bone?
Image

Monkeyboi
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Postby Monkeyboi » Mon Feb 16, 2004 3:50 pm

Sounds useful, pildanovak. It would make most sence if you could also edit that influence though.

beatabix
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Postby beatabix » Mon Feb 16, 2004 7:01 pm

Money_YAY! - why don't you just have a little delve around in the display code, see if you can replace the funny 3D kite things with some different OpenGL calls.

strangely enough, i'm with you on this one, I usually think you just spout a constant stream of crap.

I would prefer a proper set of 3D objects to represent a skeleton, rather than those outdated what-ama-hedrons. I want to get a sense of volume without resorting to adding another mesh in my scene.

later
BEAT


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