interface for newbies...another approach?

The interface, modeling, 3d editing tools, import/export, feature requests, etc

Moderators: jesterKing, stiv

shahbaz
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:01 am

interface for newbies...another approach?

Postby shahbaz » Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:07 am

I've seen too many talented people overlook blender because it is hard to use. If the current interface IS going to be kept, can we atleast have someone do a tutorial video like the one done by truespace people:
http://caligari.com/products/trueSpace/ ... ate=Spirit

Mats78
Posts: 155
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2002 5:06 pm
Location: Vantaa, Finland

Postby Mats78 » Thu Nov 07, 2002 10:01 pm

I have to say.. Blender is not hard to use - it's very natural and logical. The problem lies within the way ppl are used to windows programs, they expect a prog to look, act and behave according to some widely used model. What they don't see (being used to this) is that this model is quite clumsy and far from being very productive.

But if someone would like to make a video, why not? Could help a lot of ppl get to know Blender, at least so they could form their oppinions based on what they actually like or dislike - not on the first impression. I agree it can be daunting.

jeotero
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 5:31 am

Postby jeotero » Fri Nov 08, 2002 1:00 am

Totally agree, the interface is well designed , the only need that needs is consistency and would be better.

Just my .2 cents

salty
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2002 10:47 pm

Postby salty » Mon Nov 11, 2002 11:12 pm

Working on os x
Yes the interface is great but takes a lot of conviction to get to know! Finding good info on the net is difficult but not impossible, for programmers it might be more easy to follow but it definately needs better documentation for artist and designer. Untill now its my favourite 3D program (because of the possibilties) but I miss the Os X web plugin or player (it crashes!) (os 10.2.1)
Thanks for making it open source :)

bobmar
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2002 6:05 am

Postby bobmar » Tue Nov 12, 2002 4:42 am

Being a newbie, I can understand the initial confusion with using Blender. But, the more that I work with it, the more I come to appreciate how beautifully it is designed. Except for a few necessary mouse clicks, everything is a keystroke away. Almost every command function is completed with the left hand while camera functions and enter commands are completed with the right hand. If the user is something other than a Joystick Gamer then all of this should come quite naturally.
I do understand that most of us, myself included, are accustomed to the clumsy method of searching for familiar Icons to complete commands but, since beginning to learn Blender, I'll be the first to admit that that method is time consuming and sometime frustrating.

dreamerv3
Posts: 119
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 10:30 am

Postby dreamerv3 » Tue Nov 12, 2002 5:15 am

There's a reason the iconic and visual layouts are so popular and the reason is that they help the user more than they hinder him.

Instead of attacking visual interfaces it would be more productive to support unification of ket key based and visual based interfaces, a hybrid if you will.

Thre most productive thing for blender will be skinning in the long run, that way you'll be able to make the program behave the way YOU (not some UI designer) want it to.

From there we can simply let darwinian evolution determine the winner...

animats
Posts: 38
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 8:18 pm

Postby animats » Thu Nov 14, 2002 4:59 am

dreamerv3 wrote:There's a reason the iconic and visual layouts are so popular and the reason is that they help the user more than they hinder him.

Instead of attacking visual interfaces it would be more productive to support unification of key based and visual based interfaces, a hybrid if you will.

Thre most productive thing for blender will be skinning in the long run, that way you'll be able to make the program behave the way YOU (not some UI designer) want it to.

From there we can simply let darwinian evolution determine the winner...


I agree about visual interfaces, but don't think skinning would help. I wrote a bit about this over in the "Poll: should the GUI be changed" topic. I'm not a Blender fanatic; I'm a former Softimage|3D user. But I don't see the Blender interface as bad, just unnecessarily irritating in spots. Most of those spots are fixable. Little stuff, like a visual distinction between radio buttons and push-once buttons, would help. File selection should probably follow the usual conventions for whatever platform is being used. Changeable stuff on buttons should be visually distingushed from fixed stuff. Some of the less-used stuff that gets set once, like output frame format, could move to a pop-up. Mouse-controlled numeric input needs rework. But all this stuff is little and easy to fix.

A medium-level feature is a "key window". Offer a window type that presents all the currently valid keys as buttons. It's a huge win for new users, and doesn't impact the people who have the whole keyset in their heads.

There's harder stuff. The tough-to-implement, but necessary, "undo" needs to go in. Once you have general undo, a number of GUI problems go away. Reliable undo does wonders for the user's peace of mind.

Mouse wheel support needs to be carefully designed. Being able to move a vertex in all three dimensions without re-selecting simplifies modelling enormously. Think this one through, though; don't just hack it in.

Mouse wheel support plus undo will make modelling a much more fluid process. Less mode switching and saving.

Skins are mostly eye candy. You can't fix a GUI problem with a skin. You can make it prettier, but not more usable. None of the problems I've mentioned above could be fixed in a skin. There's also the advantage with a consistent GUI that the tutorials, books, and program all match.

xand
Posts: 86
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 9:46 am

Postby xand » Thu Nov 14, 2002 5:53 pm

i agree with the 'key window'. i've posted before about a second toolbox (CTRL+SPACE or whatever key) to show all available keystrokes in a window as a shortcut and also as a reminder for advanced user.
i don't have work on it yet because i can't achieve any compilation an i wait a easier source release.


+++

jeotero
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 5:31 am

Postby jeotero » Sat Nov 16, 2002 1:45 am

group features in ctrl+space in different menus, so people can see all the available features at a glance and may use them

Noorah
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:50 pm

A nice change

Postby Noorah » Sun Dec 15, 2002 11:11 pm

I can understand a lot of people's frustration with the program, but what I see as its strong points are all these little things. I love to go into blender because it gives me a new outlook on things, sort of a break from the usual. I was thinking about making an OS and it would have been a lot like Blender, because I love how the hot keys, and the file manager too, all work. I think that if perhaps there was something that a new user to receive that would make the transition much easier, then it would be better. But I like also that it is so small, and I don't want things like extra features that don't really help productivitiy, but really are just there to help the new user. I think good tutorials, movies perhaps, would be better. I am also a Carrara user, and they do the icon thing, but I really like the way blender does it much better. However, one thing Carrara does have is the movies, that show you exactly what to do. If someone could show me where I can find things that allow me to record movies of this stuff, I would like to start creating these. Of course I am really busy right now, but it would be nice to make some.


Return to “Interface & Tools”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest