Blender like maya...

General discussion about the development of the open source Blender

Moderators: jesterKing, stiv

joeedh
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 10:30 pm
Contact:

Post by joeedh » Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:35 am

gabio wrote:All this interface problem is anoying.

If a module loader could be coded in blender and if all big feature could be separated in small module loaded in a file ( ref to the winamp style, you got module for in, out, effect, expansion feature) that could get blender to an other level. Let say the current interface is a module!--
Yes. I believed this was proposed for Blender 3.0. But, as bfvietnam said, because Blender is written in C, this would require a 100% rewrite. From scratch (except the gameengine, of course; that's already C++).

Might happen oneday. . .or it might not. . .

joeedh

joeri
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 6:41 pm
Contact:

Post by joeri » Tue Aug 31, 2004 11:17 am

I agree Maya has a slow workflow.
And that Blender has an amazing fast workflow.
This is great if you are the boss of your project.
And I think alot of blender users are.

But... (there's the but)
Altering in blender mostly means redoing.
While in Maya most things can be redone without redoing the other parts.

( Athough I did had some trouble with UVtexmap mixing up after adding poly's to a model, thus distroying my weightmap :( bad Maya, bad! , Luckaly I could save my weightmap and reload it to the new model )

stiv
Posts: 0
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 7:58 am
Location: 45N 86W

Post by stiv » Tue Aug 31, 2004 6:06 pm

"...because Blender is written in C, this would require a 100% rewrite..."

With regards to loading modules, you kids need to learn some programming. People have been dynamically loading modules from C for years. Think .dlls or Blender's texture and sequence plugins.

bfvietnam
Posts: 0
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:54 pm

Dll's limited to Intel VM

Post by bfvietnam » Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:46 am

stiv wrote:"...because Blender is written in C, this would require a 100% rewrite..."

With regards to loading modules, you kids need to learn some programming. People have been dynamically loading modules from C for years. Think .dlls or Blender's texture and sequence plugins.
My brother says dll's for windows were designed to make use of the Intel VM model to allow Windows to relinquish ram after code in a library crashes.. ITs a throwback from the MSDOS days I suppose.. When 386's were introduced and Microsoft was determining how to build a bigger OS based on 386 sandbox VM's..

He said to me its the pain of working in windows and its just kind of accepted.. Maybe its changed since XP..

Blender coule be broken up into DLL's, but it would peobably make blender more complex to have to deal with so many different kinds of library API styles for each os.. Its a system-level call to a function, and
how does the dll access blender's memory, or do they have to arrange for shared memory?? Also would the libraries have to be thread safe?

Objects are not the best solution, I would just imagine they would allow for some abstraction.. Make it so that more developers could work on blender. Also would make it easier to map out the module relationships..

I don't know anything about C programming these days.. The last C project I did was to program a palm pilot (which is like multiprogramming in a 8086).. I use PHP these days, and I can just see how it would make the code easier to manage.. Give someone a UML diagram, its like giving a coder a syntax tree to a new language, its easy to see what is possible and how things are configured..

A nice site for learning UML..

www.phppatterns.com

Its way easier understand since its PHP, and that Sun just bought up
Zend, and the site you are using now is in PHP, should give you some clue..

Oh BTW, this is a nice program converting C++, Java and PHP to UML..
Makes it easier to see your methods and class relationships:

http://www.sparxsystems.com.au/

jesterKing
Site Admin
Posts: 207
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2002 12:48 pm
Location: Finland

Re: Blender is written in C Maya in C++

Post by jesterKing » Mon Sep 06, 2004 9:27 am

bfvietnam wrote:I've heard you can doo OO in C, but it
requires a lot more thought and the code tends to look complex for the models I can imagine
http://www.planetpdf.com/codecuts/pdfs/ooc.pdf

I have found this doesn't require more thought than using ie. C++. Maybe in that you really need to understand the fundamentals of OOP. It requires a little bit more code, but I have found that not to be a drawback.

/Nathan

bfvietnam
Posts: 0
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:54 pm

Re: Blender is written in C Maya in C++

Post by bfvietnam » Tue Sep 07, 2004 8:26 pm

jesterKing wrote:
bfvietnam wrote:I've heard you can doo OO in C, but it
requires a lot more thought and the code tends to look complex for the models I can imagine
http://www.planetpdf.com/codecuts/pdfs/ooc.pdf

I have found this doesn't require more thought than using ie. C++. Maybe in that you really need to understand the fundamentals of OOP. It requires a little bit more code, but I have found that not to be a drawback.

/Nathan
http://www.planetpdf.com/codecuts/pdfs/ooc.pdf#Page=168

Code: Select all

struct Object * add (void * _self, const void * element) {
struct Object * result;
const struct ListClass * class =
(const void *) classOf(_self);
if (isOf(class, ListClass()) && class —> add.method) {
cast(Object(), element);
result = ((struct Object * (*) ())
class —> add.method)(_self, element);
} else
forward(_self, & result, (Method) add, "add",
_self, element);
return result;
}
This is easier!!

I'm being a bit sarcastic, this is a bit messy.. But
probably not that bad..

thorpedonj
Posts: 0
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 8:53 pm

Orthographic Worklow needed in Blender

Post by thorpedonj » Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:00 pm

One of the main reasons why Blender has not caught in the industry is due to the fact that it does not follow certain industry standards. The Orthographic workflow (Top, Front, Side, Perspective) has been used by many 3d applications. Lightwave 3D, 3DSmax, Maya, etc have used this workflow for years.

For someone who is used to this, jumping into blender is a nightmare. I run blender and go, ok, where do i go, where do i start? I have noticed that 2.5 is finally going through a UI redesign! It's about time! Maybe it will make things easier for Blender newbies... Like me.

I know that Blender takes a while to get used to, but it would be nice if I could simply navigate like Maya or Max right off the bat. This would make the switch so much easier....

If blender would simply do this, it would take off so quickly!

joeri
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 6:41 pm
Contact:

Re: Orthographic Worklow needed in Blender

Post by joeri » Wed Jul 08, 2009 3:40 pm

thorpedonj wrote:One of the main reasons why Blender has not caught in the industry is due to the fact that it does not follow certain industry standards. The Orthographic workflow (Top, Front, Side, Perspective) has been used by many 3d applications. Lightwave 3D, 3DSmax, Maya, etc have used this workflow for years.

For someone who is used to this, jumping into blender is a nightmare. I run blender and go, ok, where do i go, where do i start? I have noticed that 2.5 is finally going through a UI redesign! It's about time! Maybe it will make things easier for Blender newbies... Like me.

I know that Blender takes a while to get used to, but it would be nice if I could simply navigate like Maya or Max right off the bat. This would make the switch so much easier....

If blender would simply do this, it would take off so quickly!

I believe this to be untrue:

If I open Max I cannot move a single vertex. The interface does not tell me how to do it. I cant even rotate the view around the object. Just impossible to see how to do that ( in real world walking around an object is very easy. And if its a small object turning it in your hand is easy, with easy place back to a view to work on the object )

Maya opens in 3d perspective view.
And I think most 3d people work in 3d view, at least all the (making of) photos of professional studios have screens with 3d views.
But... Most professional studios ( pixar / blue sky ) use their own renderers and need an easy export of a frame from their animation package to their renderer... In blender is impossible to assign custom shaders to your objects making preview rendering impossible, Maya has a C plugin system where (big) studios can plug into the data and export what they want with ease.

LetterRip
Posts: 0
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 7:03 am

Post by LetterRip » Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:32 pm

Joeri,

I was reading the early part of this thread where you were posting about features in Maya, that weren't in Blender and I was thinking, 'but blender has almost all of that' - the read the post date was 2004, Blender has come a long way in 5 years :). I think the only thing in your list that won't be addressed by October for 2.50 will be Mental Ray and full ray tracing.

LetterRip
joeri wrote:Maya is better on many levels. It's worse on some others.
The main thing that is better on Maya is that when there is a new release it has new features, not just a facelift.

But lets make a little list:
It has dynamics.
Soft/Ridged bodies.
It has particles that can be changed in direction by wind, gravity or other forces.
Every slider / value is animatable.
Every slider / value is scriptable.
User can define own attributes without programming.
Driven keys.
It has deforming hiearchy (mutliple lattices and deformers on objects)
Fast bind tools for connecting meshes to bones.
IK / FK switching.
Paint effects.
NURBS / Curve editing. ( Intersect / Trim / Round tool )
N-gons.
Align tools, snap tools.
Character system with motion clip blending.
Audio in playback (for lip syncing)
Extensive Help.
Export to renderman, mental ray. Full raytracer.
Soft shadows.

Probably much more,...

HW3WEB
Posts: 0
Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:48 am
Location: UK

Love Blender

Post by HW3WEB » Sat Aug 29, 2009 11:02 am

I am maybe not experience designer but for me after some time use Blender I feel lost in 3dMAX or Maya , so huge plus of Blender , one you know is so easy to use.

Even if I will buy Maya I will still use Blender.

Huge plus for Blender for interface.

And respect to people who made this software .

Post Reply