PocketPC

General discussion about the development of the open source Blender

Moderators: jesterKing, stiv

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Tue Oct 26, 2004 1:31 pm

Hello Kenden!

How are you? That was cool at the conference!!
I tried to have a look on the source… holala!! I tried to install gygwin but I need a connection… with my poor modem, it will take a while!
But never mind, I will first try to compile blender on my PC with visual C++… try to understand a little how that works and then try to port it in Pocketpc… But it will take lot of time because I never do that and begin with our best program Blender is maybe ambitious.

Is it maybe possible on this forum to have contact with people that previously ported Blender to ipaq only to know how they proceed?

goldentaiji
Posts: 0
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2004 7:15 am

Post by goldentaiji » Mon Nov 15, 2004 2:53 am

:D Yeah, at least porting Blender to pocket PC's is active. I have a IPAQ 3955, but unfortunately the version of Blender 2.03 that ran on an earlier version of IPAQ doesn't run on my handheld.

It'd be great if you figure out how to port modeling and redering onto a pocket PC. Blender on the run, :P .

If you'll be able to pull this off, the game engine and animation can't be too far behind it. Imagine Blender pocket PC games. Lol, that's what I'll be waiting for.

I'm rooting for you russose.

malCanDo
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 1:44 pm
Location: Ireland
Contact:

Post by malCanDo » Mon Nov 15, 2004 1:46 pm

Hi russose,

Good luck with the Pocket PC project.

If you are really serious about getting it done, you could contact Ton directly, who might be able to set you up on the projects area of Blender ( see http://projects.blender.org/ at the bottom of the screen ). You might need to show some sort of progress, or previous Pocket PC development, in order that the project gets taken on seriously.

If you had some small progress, and a location on projects.blender.org, you might find that a number of similarly minded developers will contact you regarding helping you out.

Mal

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Wed Nov 17, 2004 7:00 pm

Hello All,

Let's have a little summary for what I tried to do :=)

As I explained, I have No skills in programming for a so Big cool program… Thus, I am discovering :=)

1) I tried to download Cygwin how it is explained in Blender Site... but however, given that I have NO permanent Internet connection at home, I ever missing files... and from work not so easy to get them... so I tried something else...

2) I tried with Dev-C++... but how to run a make with that :=( ... I tried to import all source files (*.h. *.c, *.ccp...) but dev-c++ is not so happy with all thousands of files... ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!! How to compile Blender with such a program??

3) I am French but living in Germany… a friend (german) gives me Visual C++… But all in german :=) Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh No way to understand!

At this point, I begin to think: “ok, now, you have to succeed a little nevertheless, you will need more than a life to play with Blender on your PPC!”

4) I had a new idea... I loaded in my computer a knoppix (old but cool!)... cool... here I can make a "make"!... but problem with my USB key!!! ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Whatever... I managed to write on it, but yesterday, without reason, my knoppix didn't want to read on my usb key where Blender Source are!!!!
I will try today night and let you know :=) But I don't have good feeling there... Let see...

So what I planned... As I said, when I will succeed to compile Blender (I hope before 2010!), I will try to understand “what do what” playing with the source… I mean, how to de-activate functions, how to change Graphical Interface (no idea today !). What I am worried about is opengl because there are no opengl in pocketpc… there is an opengl ES… no idea how to use it today… and the graphical Interface will need to be changed a lot to be workable on a pocketpc… the screen is super small and there is no mouse on a pocketpc :=) Lot of fun!

Hi Mal, for the moment, I thing it is better to disturb nobody :=) You know I am not a developer and I have few time (couple of hours every week)… and I have no idea about the amount of work…
I purchase the development kit for pocket pc but didn’t receive it! I hope I will receive it soon :=)

Ok, that was a summary of this adventure, which at this stage is not so successful! I hope it will change :=)

Have all a good night,
Salvatore

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Tue Nov 23, 2004 5:30 pm

Hello all,

Ok, I managed to compile the source with Cygwin... fine, it is working. But I needed to download some libraries for Windows (with CVS). How will I have these libraries for Pocketpc?? How can I built them?

I look also for Python for pocketpc... I found that:

http://www.murkworks.com/Research/Pytho ... n/Overview

I didn't receive the developpement Kit for Pocketpc... I am waiting for that.

Do someone have a link for a tutorial to import the Blender source in Visual C++ "manually"... Because this developpement kit will use the same "methodology" of Visual C++ but I will probably not be able to use the project Files of the source.

Ok, let see :=)

Have a nice day,
Salvatore

JWalton
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Oct 13, 2002 7:39 pm
Contact:

Post by JWalton » Tue Nov 23, 2004 6:45 pm

russose wrote:So what I planned... As I said, when I will succeed to compile Blender (I hope before 2010)
you mean before 'mobile windows 2010' (gives you a couple more years :-)

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Mon Nov 29, 2004 4:35 pm

Hello,

Only to let you know...

I post this message on the list:


Hello All,

I would like to port Blender on Pocketpc ! I already post messages on the forum:

http://www.blender.org/modules.php?op=m ... pic&t=3443

I already compiled Blender on Windows with cygwin. It worked!
I downloaded and installed eMbedded Visual C++ 4.0 (with sp4) and the SDK Windows Mobile 2003 pour Pocket PC:

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/deta ... laylang=en


http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/deta ... laylang=en

I have to say that I am not an expert in programming and I am a little lost :=) I need your help guys :=) Maybe directly from Ton, I can ever dream :=) Ok, let’s finish joking!

I didn’t know how to begin… the first thing I need to do is to import the whole Blender project in eMbedded Visual C++ . Given that the environment for Pocketpc is like Visual C++, I compared the folder “\projectfiles” and “\source”, here are the results:

“\creator”, “\icons”, “\tools” and “darwin” are only in “\source”
“\datatoc” and “sumo” are only in “\projectfiles”
“\Blender”, “\Gameengine” and “\Kernel” are in both “\source” and “\projectfiles”

In “\Blender”,
“\include” and “\quicktime” are only in “\source”
“\glut” is only in “\projectfiles”
In “\Gameengine”
“\Blenderroutine” and “\Pydoc” are only in “\source”
“\Blenderhoak” is only in “\projectfiles”

What files do I need to import? I think I have to do the same thinks that is done with Visual C++ .When I create a project, I have folder “resource”, “header” and “Source”… Do I have to use them and import all *.h in header for example?? I don’t think so…
And when the files are imported, what else in the environment do I need to check or do? How can I say eMbedded Visual C++ 4.0 (=Visual C++!) to create the appropriate dlls, to say him not to use opengl but opengl ES, to say him to built the Blender "intern" and extern libraries?
Escuse me for these stupid questions but I need some help to finish this project before 2010 :=)

Thank you very much,
Salvatore



Here is the answer from Ton:


Hi,

I am no expert *at all* on project files. But I can assure you there'll
be a lot of other problems you have to survive for a port;

- You will have to develop a full port for the GHost library. That not
only means a lot of new code, but also sufficient experience with C++
and low level MS Windows CE coding.
- You will need a full functional OpenGL library for the mobile. It is
very likely not all used opengl commands are supported (with any useful
speed or at all).
- support for float or double is very poor on mobiles. For that reason
the engine code itself is very unlikely to be running in any reliable
state.
- Since the last iPAQ port Blender has incorporated a lot of
workstation/pc specific features, ranging from audio libraries to
Freetype font support.

The previous port on iPAQ was done succesfully mainly because the
developer (Daniel Dunbar) had a full understanding of how Blender
works, coded his own opengl (from scratch!), coded this with fixed
point (no floats) math, and coded his own glut stuff. And last but not
least; used the Blender 2.04 code base which was much more portable and
free of C++.

I don't want to discourage you... or no, maybe I better *do* :) ! Such
a project is a major challenge, only to be done succesfully when you
have lotsof time and full understanding already of the full range of
problems you'll encounter.

-Ton-


What is sure, is that it is not so easy... and for a beginner in coding... it will be funny... but let's try.

nay
Posts: 29
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:56 am
Location: sydney, australia
Contact:

Post by nay » Tue Nov 30, 2004 11:45 pm

your ambition is inspiring. keep at it!

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:07 pm

Hallo all,

First I wish you an happy new year.

I write you to make you aware about the little progress of my work.
Today, I compiled Ghost (without Menubar), I understood good the EVC++ development environment and I play a little with Klimt (opengl). For opengl, I was also thinking if Opengl ES is not better because Klimt is not maintained anymore I think… But it is really not the priority today:=)
I also began to run first tests: the “gltest” that is provided with ghost… As a reminder, there is no iostream in pocketpc but to show information, I use dialog box… no real problem, only maybe for the window management… don’t know.

Result of the first gltest:
When I run the test… the program build a window… but the title of the window is not printed correctly (boxes with a t?? ) and the window is in the background… the content of the window is nothing… we see what is back of the window… probably a problem of swapbuffer… don’t know. What must exactly this test do when ghost run perfectly?

Ok, here are my results… the real work of making ghost work properly for pocketpc began :=) Let’s continue…

By,
Salvatore

gabio
Posts: 0
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 6:41 am
Location: Canada - Québec - Sherbrooke
Contact:

Post by gabio » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:17 pm

hats off. you on the road.
me can't help with opengl though.

DRF
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2004 2:06 am
Location: Midlands, UK

Post by DRF » Sun Jan 16, 2005 7:51 pm

Hi,

Just wishing you the best of luck with your attempts. I wouldn't know where to start personally! I have an ipaq and probably wouldn't model with it or anything but it would be useful to have a viewer etc.
As you have recognised with modern ipaqs (SD cards etc) size of the install is not to much of an issue (assuming it wouldn't get much if at all larger than the full pc version). The main problem I can see is getting all the required info and buttons on to the screen.
Blender is quite good at the moment for getting information on the screen and swapping between all the various window types/modes. Having multiple screens I think would be pointless on that size screen so possibly have a user interface that is like the buttons window in blender now full screen but the back ground is the 3D window. So that the panels can be moved on top of a landscape 3D window, so allowing you to place the panels in the most suitable space depending on the shape of the model your working on (and allowing for semi-transparent panels).

Sorry for my vague description of how I would imagine the user interface. The mouse shouldn't be a problem as holding the pointer on the screen in one spot for long periods of time in many programs works as a right click, so some zooming feature will have to be made into an external button on the PDA or an onscreen button, but the rest should be ok, tho modelling without the keyboard shortcuts would be tedious.

Essentially this sounds interesting but I think some serious thought is needed and a seperate project page so that threads can be started on all the issues like what features to leave in and which would be to impractical to convert and issues of how to design/modify the user interface as well as the technical issues in implementation.

Hope this takes off but I think to much for 1 person to do alone as more than a simple direct port is needed.
Daniel

deoli
Posts: 0
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 11:41 am

Post by deoli » Thu Jan 27, 2005 11:45 am

:D :D :D :D

yes please!!

any way we can encourage you? send you a hot cup of coffee now and then?

no, serious. keep it up!!

JWalton
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Oct 13, 2002 7:39 pm
Contact:

Post by JWalton » Wed Feb 02, 2005 2:03 am

quake 1 engine for GBA and now pocketpc:

http://www.pocketmatrix.com/forums/view ... hp?t=20416

russose
Posts: 0
Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 5:01 pm

Post by russose » Tue Jun 14, 2005 12:00 pm

Hallo Everybody,

I finished this week end to port GHOST on Pocketpc. I needed lot of time to understand what is doing what and why… but today, the monkey test is running fine. Thanks Maarten and Kent for your help! Today, we are using the 4 hardware buttons:
- First button to able/enable right click with stylus (the stylus is a left click)
- Second button to able/enable Alt Key
- Third button to able/enable Control Key
- Fourth button to able/enable Shift Key
In the future, we could implement hardware shortcut for Pad buttons. Let’s see…

I am using the Klimt opengl ES implementation.

I will now move on Blender... Let's see :=) But I am a little slow :=)

Have a nice day,
Salvatore

malCanDo
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 1:44 pm
Location: Ireland
Contact:

Post by malCanDo » Tue Jun 14, 2005 1:20 pm

Hi Salvatore,

That is great news, keep up the great work!

> I will now move on Blender... Let's see :=) But I am a little slow :=)

Heh, you've moved mountains in the last few months, and they have to be moved pretty slowly ;)

Mal

Post Reply