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Muse RenderMan compliant with Blender

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 5:25 pm
by pixelbox
Hello there.
As Project Administrator of Muse, I would like to hear from Blender users what is the main characteristics that you want to see in a RenderMan compliant renderer, in this case Muse? http://rmuse.sourceforge.net

Cheers

Bruno A. F. Patatas

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 5:50 pm
by -efbie-
-Motion blur
-pass rendering
-zbuffer output
:)

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 6:38 pm
by rednelb
speed

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 7:49 pm
by bertram
Yes! To me it's speed too.
A renderer that's optimized for speed down to each single cycle of a CPU (and probably the GPU)!

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 10:57 pm
by CubOfJudahsLion
Seamless integration (a la yafray plugin) It would be ideal to just select the shader from the menu (oh please please please ;) )

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 11:04 pm
by chimera
CubOfJudahsLion wrote:Seamless integration (a la yafray plugin) It would be ideal to just select the shader from the menu (oh please please please ;) )
this is already in development (aqsis, but that's renderman-like, or even renderman-compliant)

Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 3:27 pm
by pixelbox
I am aware that spped is a great concern among 3D artists :D . While I want to maintain a good speed-quality ratio in Muse, the rendering quality will be the main characteristic of Muse. But I can already assure you that Muse will be speedy enough.

Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 6:27 pm
by bertram
How did you come up with the name "Muse"? What does it mean and what does it stand for.
By the way the name Muse is not very unique. You're likely to associale quite a lot of other projects with it...

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 3:06 pm
by pixelbox
Muse is a name. Only that. No hidden meanings. What Muse stands for? Well, it's a RenderMan compliant renderer, and more in-depth information can be obtained at the official website. The name Muse is not very unique? Can you tell me why it should be unique? Would be relevant for the project if it had another name? It will render better? Associate other projects with it? Humm... Do you know any other RenderMan compliant named Muse? I don´t.
Muse intends to be what it name says. An inspiring Muse to create awe inspiring CG images.

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 4:54 pm
by bertram
>> Can you tell me why it should be unique?
Yes: Using different words for different things helps avoiding to talk at cross-purposes.
I don't care if Google spits out a 1,000,000 results on "muse +software". I just wanted to give you that hint.

>> Would be relevant for the project if it had another name? It will render better?
Not for the resulting rendering. But since you promote it on this site you're apparently interested in the popularity of your renderer. And I'm sure that the name would have an impact on this. (dumb example: Would you consider naming it "snailtracer"? Certainly not!)

>> Associate other projects with it? Humm... Do you know any other RenderMan compliant named Muse? I don´t.
Me neither. But look at this:
http://muse.serverkommune.de/ | http://osx.freshmeat.net/projects/musedaemon/ | http://namingmuse.berlios.de/ | http://mscore.sourceforge.net/news.php | http://www.graphics-muse.com
You may now probably understand my confusion when I read the title of your thread.

>> Muse intends to be what it name says. An inspiring Muse to create awe inspiring CG images.
Well, I'm very curious to see the first results of your effort.
BTW: Thank you for taking blender users into account for your survey :wink:

Enough with being a wisenheimer... sorry to all for that! It's not meant to be offending.

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 8:50 pm
by pixelbox
Ok, It´s all fine bertram :) . I am just a little bit tired of what some people are writing about Muse. Things like: " There is no point in another GPL RenderMan compliant "; " Why another Open Source Renderer "; " It will never be released "... and that sort of things. They even complain because they havent seen a single line of code :shock: . For all the people that write this about Muse and call my Academy of things like " stupid idea ", I just have one thing to say: I intend to deal and work with professionals. So kids, play with your toys.
Blender users are very important to the development of Muse, since I whant to provide a close integration of Blender with Muse.

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 9:45 pm
by Pablosbrain
Look forward to working with it. As I'm currently working on an animated short and am finally getting close to the animation part of it... I've been doing tests and looking forward to the point when I'll be ready to render it.

As the integration of Yafray progresses and grows it may in the end suit my current projects needs. But I will still definitely be looking longer term for a fast/full featured/integrated solution that can scale a bit better than Yafray which already is starting to choke on some of my files.

Which brings me to my main requirement for another renderer. Good if not Great memory usage. I want fast rendering but I also would love to put some of my old machines to use with linux or whatever for rendering... My old machines sometimes only have 128megs of ram. My current scene is very detailed and texture rich. 720megs of textures to be precise. I've already started to go back and remodel some of my objects with SubSurfs in mind as well as just cleaning up the geometry. But definitely good memory usage and possibly ways to have it automatically analyze a scene and load and unload textures to/from ram as needed. Definitely not as fast... but an option I would love to see as it would help make some of my older machines usefull again.

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 9:46 pm
by Pablosbrain
Also... I would love to help test and work with your renderer as it grows. I'm just not a coder, so integration into blender would be a must for me. I'm good with scripting.. but some of the more mathematical stuff flys straight through my head. Look forward to seeing more!

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 11:44 pm
by cekuhnen
in my opinion yafray is slow and lacks in terms of shader support for users not coders. blenders own renderer is quite nice but lacks quite a lot of what i need for my daly work today.

so incase you are realy serious about getting blender hooked up with a renderman comp. engine in my opinion all what renderman offers is important.

most important:
speed
true displacement
ao gi color bleeding caustics
easyer basic shader system
or a shader generater like crafter for different platforms
motion blur
dof
and ...

i worked a lot with 3delight in the past and well it convinced me the power fo renderman systems.

claas

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 12:10 am
by pixelbox
Thanks for the opinions. Memory usage is always a great concern. I intend to provide a good rendering speed-quality ratio, but 128megs of ram are very low for a scene with 720megs of texture. Memory usage will always be a concern to Muse Development Team, and we will provide Muse with an efficient gestion of memory usage. Just don´t throw away you old machines yet :D .
Yes cekuhnen, you can be sure that I am serious about providing a good integration between Muse and Blender.
I also believe that all that RenderMan can offer is very good. The shading language is something that can scare some people the first time they work with RenderMan.
RenderMan is very powerfull, and combined with Blender I believe it can produce really astoundishing CG work.