Page 5 of 5

Re: please keep with these ideas !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 12:09 am
by lukep
GDP_Sabrina wrote:Hello folks,

the dude, who created that visual is a god !!

Please keep up with this concept. I really really loive blender, but I can't understand and learn all these key strokes. I really need a visual click-click interface, where I can select from a palette and not knowing every shortcut.

Please stay with these fantastic ideas !!!!!!!!

That is then probably a pretty impassable problem. click-click UI is not how blender should work

Blender UI is based on some strong base concepts like no-overlaps, direct action on all elements, no modal cycles, pre-selection, who are derived from those of one of the UI gurus, Jeff Raskin. Those concepts are here applied for efficiency, not ease of use, but this explain why the UI is *very* fast and good for those who are trained with it. With time some drive has been lost in that area, but the philosophy should be kept.

The main problem with blender UI is not that it is difficult to learn, but it is different from many software.
to really appreciate blender, you must learn the base concepts.
print the quickstart pdf and keep it as reference.

Now there is room for improvement of the UI aiming for ease of use, and action icons are a way, even if it conflict a bit with the base lean interface philosophy. But dont expect a copycat of eg C4D interface.

An example is the C4D movement (transform in blender speak) icon in tool bar. This is not possible in blender because of the "direct action" concept. when you click outside the editor, current context is lost, especially if you have more than one 3D view. our current solution (transform widgets selection in 3Dview header) is not perfect, but compatible with the blender way. And the way everyone use is G shortcut because it is much faster (or the gestures for some).

After event refactor, a lot of things can and will happen in revorking the GUI, but we must be very carefull to not damage the way things work.

One thing very difficult now, but that should happen is a lot more drag&drop and contextual commands.

One thing where blender lacks a lot too is visual cues. Again refactor will help here. commercial sofwares are often good in that area, as it is a known strong buy criteria, even if it do little in term of productivity.

Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:07 pm
by LetterRip

actually Blender has buttons for zooming, and panning and rotating the interface but they were commented out of versions that have been done since going open source.

I do hope imitating a Cinema4D interface becomes possible - we shall have to wait and see what Ton comes up with :)


Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2007 12:57 pm
by lukep
LetterRip wrote:lukep,

actually Blender has buttons for zooming, and panning and rotating the interface but they were commented out of versions that have been done since going open source.

I do hope imitating a Cinema4D interface becomes possible - we shall have to wait and see what Ton comes up with :)

If it is done in headers, that obviously work. As general pallet, it is so contradictory with current methods, it is hard to think how to embed it.

Now, the event refactor will be obviously time to rethink a lot of thing, and
all mouse actions are one target. But we must be very carefull there.

One thing i want badly is active contextual menus as in solidowrks. this is a very efficient way of doing things. That means that the 3D cursor would have to be relegated to a secondary position (with a modifier key) but that is probably a good thing as it is one of the things that most newbies are really uneasy with.

the key point is that it must be thinked in advance, i dont think we should wait for Ton on that (and that is not the point of what he will do)


Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 3:31 am
by Azrael
Here is an update, kAinStein mentioned that the filebrowser needed a redeisng, I agree. Here is my redesign:


Right clicking on a folder would allow you to add it to your favourites.

Here is an update with create folder:


Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 10:09 am
by alarionfirn
That filebrowser would be a lot better than the current one. I'd only add a way to create new folders (haven't found one in the existing one).

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 6:21 pm
by Azrael

Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:37 pm
by kAinStein
@Azrael: I don't know if you knew, but there are some few designs for the file browser. Perhaps a good source of inspiration. But I like the look of yours.

Here is the most "classic" design with a mockup - it's rather old but still does have some good ideas that probably would be needed for an up to date file chooser:

I also have some mockups for a file chooser somewhere - but I need to search that stuff first. Perhaps we can bring that together.

But most important is one thing: What needs a file dialog? It needs a good navigation and fast access for experienced users. Most common file choosers do have a location bar where you can type in a path (Mac and Gnome don't have them directly - that's one reason why I don't like them - I don't think a user should be considered stupid, even though he might be). In addition they's got a fast access to the file systems or volumes where you can directly choose a new location.

A good navigation would include the possibility to get back and forward (this comes close to an undo/ redo mechanism). Then a possibility to have different file repositories for different projects, textures, etc. Those repositories actually don't have to be at the same location. So you need a mechanism to create categories and add, edit or remove locations where you can find what you need. For example: You've got a project with project related materials which don't have to belong to you. But you would also like to access your own materials to find what you want.

Another neat thing is a file filter that only shows the kind of files you want to see. That avoids clutter. If I'm searching a .blend then I don't want to have anything else.

Even better filtering is provided by an incremental file filter that filters the files on what you keep typing (take a look at the KDE file dialog to see what I mean).

I will come back with more...