Antlab wrote:Kainstein,
being quite new to this forum, I don't know if insults, as the ones you use, are normally tolerated by the moderators. In any case, as en educated guy, I obviously will not follow you on that ugly route.
Oh!
You don't follow the ugly route? Just for remembering: You started it with your own behaviour! Totally ignoring argumentation that doesn't fit your view, making false assumptions, twisting words, not understanding basic concepts and being instead sarcastic, arrogant and mocking about other people that have totally different needs than you is definitely not a sign of a good education!
Actually I find the discussion quite amusing, and in some sense out of time.
Prove me wrong! No?
I am happy to know that in your country secretaries are all computer gurus, and that in your offices mice are let new in their boxes.
Did I write that? I did write that also secretaries extendedly use hotkeys instead of GUI elements in their work as an example (one of three - I can bring up more) - which falsifies your assumptions. And I pointed out that an occasional user usually does not. Learn to read! I even went over gamers and pro computer artists that have close deadlines.
Maybe it remains misterious why a certain Bill Gates became the wealthiest man in the world,
I don't know what Bill Gates does have to do with user interfaces. Actually he got rich with MS-DOS, a BASIC implementation (which both actually weren't even MS creations) and quite a few office programs (MS Word, MS Multiplan, later Excel and some more) which were all character-oriented. But I know: Bill Gates invented the GUI and Steve Ballmer invented the internet.
considering that in your opinion people DON'T use GUIs
My opinion? Where did I write anything like that? Again totally wrong assumptions!
(I can assure that here in Italy we use them, also the secretaries, but hardly we can buy all the tens of millions of copies of Windows and Office
).
Keep the sarcasm! Seems that you can't read!
You are completely free to ignore reality and scientifically calculate the number of clicks ,
You haven't understood a word of what I was writing, have you? Does not seem so. Actually you are ignoring facts and twisting my words!
To your example: How many times in a minute do you change context (in the way of performing actions) while using your microscope? How many times do you change context while modelling? No difference, isn't it?
but the world seems going in another direction, where graphical elements in interfaces are the standard,
Did I deny that? Learn to read! In addition: Command lines and shortcuts are also the standard - believe it or not. Not only for a longer period of time but they remained extremly reliable, fast, slim and kept consistency over all those years - graphical elements are changing constantly. Take a look at Win 3.1, go over Win 95 and the versions that followed and now take a look at the new MS ribbons. Something similar on the Mac and with KDE and Gnome. If all that you are claiming would be true - why all those paradigm shifts?! Can you tell me that? Hu... Evolution? Or just because they can't fulfill the marketing promises of intuitivity and efficiency?
and mouse movements not so a pain.
A good GUI minimizes mouse movement and even any kind of interaction to the most needed. A good GUI is ergonomic, should be consitent and adaptive. A good GUI is reliable, efficient and is meant to maximize your productivity (without productivity you don't have a need to use a computer besides playing). If you are a pro (meaning that you are supposed to know what you are doing) then you need a totally different amount of productivity than an occasional user which only want his task finished regardless how long it takes. Again you are ignoring this fact!
You can also simply narrow down your vision to hardcore users, but the rest of the people, the vast majority, surely want continue to use computer, they like making a lot of things with them (including drawing and create 3D stuff), and their preferences are quite clear
The vast majority of computer users are not professionals in all areas! Most aren't even professionals at all. You seem to forget that one... If you had really interest in Blender you would know what I wrote in the prior posting. Actually you don't - for me that is enough explanation...
Graphical elements are good to get a start into something. Graphical elements should be good to organise the information you need. But graphical elements are
only one part of a human-machine interface. If a hobbyist can live with it do perform a basic routine action in 7.5 seconds instead of 1.5 seconds then it's ok. He doesn't have any pressure. For him it is a hobby. For a professional it isn't always ok. That's why they work differently. For a professional it would already be enough to have customizable hotkeys so he can adapt the software to his habits. Most probably he wouldn't need toolbars with many icons and he actually would set up his personal workspace for his duties. Got it? Or should I draw a picture that you can understand that?
(you still forget Siggraph, not exactly a bunch of newbies, I think).
What was with Siggraph? That there are studios interested in Blender but that they want to wait after the UI overhaul? Hm. Have you managed even one software migration project? Do you know how much it costs? Do you know how much preparation is nessessary? It's not only installing the new software and on it goes. You've got to analyse the needs, the integration possibilities like exporting data, use of existent tools and data and make instruction curricula: Which means that you analyse who needs to learn what - especially the differences between packages. After that you've got to train the users onto the new software which takes time and is often the most expensive part in a big-scale migration. Now if a software manufacturer (regardless if this is a OSS project or a commercial company) announces a modification of the UI then it would the dumbest thing to do making the migration before the change occured which probably would need another training. Same with porting tools, integration into existing workflows, customization and the like. This all takes a lot of time and money - additionally time is money. Now what?
Furthermore, as others already noticed, you don't make a great favour to Blender by insulting on public forums people with different views.
Again: You started the bullshit behaviour! Exchange of arguments is ok - anything else is not. I'm still waiting for you to prove me wrong. Instead you are constantly attacking me personally - and you actually don't know anything about me. Further: As it seems you don't have any knowledge of what you are preaching. If you think that your point of view is in any kind superior - prove me wrong! You actually continued talking about a "text interface" and weren't even able to explain what you mean. I can't see any "text interface" when looking at Blender.
Many people, including me, love the program, but they also expect a cordial community, willing to discuss with the not so hard core users the future development.
Including you? Really? Then you should first get a basic knowledge of the topic before starting to argue. And keep in mind: I don't mind an exchange of arguments - but what you started doesn't have anything in common with such an exchange! Learn to read and understand what people are writing. Then you can make up your mind, prove wrong what someone else has written if it's wrong and make a consistent, well-thought proposal instead of showing your ignorance and disrespect by being sarcastic.
I've taken Sabrina and her problem for serious and I've taken Azrael and his work for serious (and I'm waiting what new ideas he has) - but sorry: I can't take you for serious anymore! You've demonstrated too much ignorance...
)
